Flex4k help

[jbeez]

I have 4 HDHomeRun Prime units, but I just picked up a Flex 4k this week, and I had someone come out and install an antenna on my roof.

They were surprised that I was not picking up a specific channel (ION). 61.1

This is a link to what stations I should probably be getting: https://www.rabbitears.info/s/1242226

So if you see channel 17.1 and 61.1 seem to be at the EXACT same location,
This is the signal stats for 17.1
Modulation Lock 8vsb
Signal Strength 83%
Signal Quality 100%
Symbol Quality 100%

The installer was stumped and thought I might need a bigger antenna, also we were trying to troubleshoot this today in the rain and heavy cloud cover, which also seemed to mess with his phone GPS which he tried to use to line the antenna up.

Antenna is pointing about 250 degrees

Any tips on what to check to see why im not getting 61.1?

[jbeez]

Also....

Is there an easy way for me to kind of spit out a report of the signal strength for each channel the unit is picking up?

Thanks

[Cabal]

Also....

Is there an easy way for me to kind of spit out a report of the signal strength for each channel the unit is picking up?

Thanks

If you aren't command line-averse, you can run a channel scan and log it all to a file:

`hdhomerun_config MYTUNER scan /tuner3 ~/scan.log`

[Cabal]

And to your original question, that channel is on RF 34. Do you have an LTE/5G filter in use? You may need one - and if so, install it close to the antenna.

The channel scan would help to see if you have unusually high signal strength on that RF.

[jbeez]

Thanks Cabal,

I do have a channel master LTE filter(tried with and without). Right now its on the flex but I can move it back a little bit. Since the antenna is on the roof I can't really get up there to put it on the antenna but I can put it at the end of that cable run where it comes into the house.

if its RF 34, then I think this is the scanning info:
SCANNING: 593000000 (us-bcast:34)
LOCK: none (ss=59 snq=0 seq=0)

then compare it to 17.1 (rf17)
SCANNING: 491000000 (us-bcast:17)
LOCK: 8vsb (ss=81 snq=100 seq=100)

Seems like a big difference in signal?

I emailed SD support, maybe this flex has a bad tuner or maybe I just have an issue in my wiring somewhere.

[jbeez]

plot twist, when i connect my newer samsung TV tuner instead of the FlexHD, it ALSO doesn't see the ion channel.

[signcarver]

Why are you expecting a station from the same place that already has '"low" signal strength (i consider near 80%, though often usable, low) on the working channel to pick up a station broadcasting at half that power?

[kyl416]

WPXN is likely interfering with WPPX in your location anytime atmospheric boost conditions are favoring NYC

Long story short, during the analog era WPPX transmitted closer to NJ/Delaware border, but during the 2009 DTV transition they agreed to accept interference from WPXN NYC and WSWB Scranton in order to move further north to the Roxborough antenna farm.

[jbeez]

Why are you expecting a station from the same place that already has '"low" signal strength (i consider near 80%, though often usable, low) on the working channel to pick up a station broadcasting at half that power?

I’m very new to this. I have no idea that 80% means a low signal. Can you share some reference numbers? Do you think that would change by pointing the antenna a few degrees differently? I know the installer was having some issues the day he was here because of heavy cloud cover.

[jbeez]

WPXN is likely interfering with WPPX in your location anytime atmospheric boost conditions are favoring NYC

Long story short, during the analog era WPPX transmitted closer to NJ/Delaware border, but during the 2009 DTV transition they agreed to accept interference from WPXN NYC and WSWB Scranton in order to move further north to the Roxborough antenna farm.

I was getting NY stations too and they were kind of ok except once in a while I had a reception error pop up so I just disabled them in the config so I only watch the philly versions.

[kyl416]

I’m very new to this. I have no idea that 80% means a low signal.

80% is just the raw signal strength, the second value signal quality, aka the signal-to-noise ratio, is what matters more, especially when it comes to RF numbers that have co-channel interference.

Since you're in an area where you can get both NYC and Philly stations, what you are seeing in the "signal strength" for RF 34 is a combo of WPPX and WPXN, the "signal quality" is how well it's decoding WPPX over the "noise" from WPXN.

On channels that are conflict free in your area like WPHL's RF 17 or WCAU's RF 28, the "signal strength" reading is just of the Philly station.

Do you think that would change by pointing the antenna a few degrees differently?

WPXN transmits from the upper antenna of the new 1WTC that also has WCBS (RF 36), WWOR/WRNN (RF 25) and WMBC (RF 18). WPPX transmits from a side mounted antenna on WPVI's tower at the Roxborough antenna farm. If your antenna is directional enough, rotating it to find a sweet spot that weakens the NYC stations can help. Mounting it on a side wall so your house is blocking the NYC stations can make a difference too.

[jbeez]

It looks a lot like this antenna

https://a.co/d/3lQoLeY

I can’t figure out how to post a pic from my phone.
Waiting to hear back from an antenna specialist to recommend a new antenna

[kyl416]

The frequency specs for that antenna (170-860 MHz) don't include VHF-lo (54-88 MHz) which is needed for reliable reception of WDPN/2 (MeTV HD/CourtTV/Mystery/H&I/Retro/Catchy/Story/Pocono Television/Newsmax2), WACP/4 (TCT/Family/ACE/Religious) and WPVI/6 (ABC*/Localish/ThisTV along with 57.4 Nosey and 57.5 FaveTV). Any qualified antenna installer working in the Philly DMA, which has always required VHF-lo reception going back to the experimental TV era, should have told you this in advanced instead of wasting your time and money. They should have also been aware of the the co-channel issues involving WPPX/WPXN and WFPA-CD/WNBC, which have been around since the DTV transition before mounting the antenna in a spot that can also pick up the NYC stations.

*While right now you can currently get 106.1 WPVI via WPSG's UHF 33 ATSC 3.0 signal, there's no guarantee that they won't turn on DRM protection in the future as ABC is a A3SA licensee.

[jbeez]

I used "Ed's antennas" which was recommended by antennamanPA as one of two installers for around here. He just showed up and put the antenna up, it might not be that exact model but it looks like it.

He left, but said he would come swap a bigger one on for just the cost difference of the antenna, which was $50. So I'm going to see about getting the best for my situation and assume he'll honor that swap out at no charge if I'm paying for the antenna

[jasonl]

If you look in the Technical Data section for WPPX on RabbitEars, you'll see that they use a directional antenna that greatly limits power output in certain directions, with the minimum strength going to 70°, 130°, 250°, and 310°. 70° happens to be the exact heading for your location. So, you're getting 51.6 kW ERP on that broadcast. WPHL uses a nondirectional pattern, so you're getting the full 645 kW from them. Converted to the HDHomeRun's signal strength scale, that's about an 18% difference in strength, so pretty close to what you're actually seeing. Weak signal plus co-channel interference from WPXN would account for the reception issues. A bigger, more directional antenna might help (or not). I'd probably go with the Winegard HD8200U. It's a big beast of an antenna at 14' long, but it'll improve reception on the UHF channels and pick up WPVI and WDPN.