Encryption

ATSC 3.0 Forum
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bakerbk64
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Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2023 2:08 pm
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Re: Encryption

Post by bakerbk64 »

Long time lurker, but had a free moment so thought I'd chime in.

I bought an HDHR 4K Flex 4K about 5 months ago. I knew then that it could not decode encrypted channels but in my situation I currently don't care and will patiently wait for the day that it can.

Here's my situation...

I live in the Kansas City metropolitan area and can get strong ATSC 1.0 signals. I have a PLEX server and enjoy the fact that I get 4 more tuners from my HDHR along with my other 2 tuners for watching/recording simultaneous shows. The PLEX sever has better recording functionality (better guide, deleting commercials, etc.) than the HDHR recording capabilities, so I use my PLEX for recording. I can also use my PLEX to view my shows outside of my house. For watching live OTA broadcasts I really like the network tuner aspect of the HDHR and use it often to watch live shows especially sports. I also have a Hisense TV that has an ATSC 3.0 tuner and handles DRM just fine. With the Hisense I am able to compare the quality of the current state of ATSC 1.0 vs ATSC 3.0, and as everyone knows in this forum, there are very little if any quality differences since there is currently no 4K OTA content. I say all of this to reinforce the fact that I can patiently await for the day that the HDHR can handle DRM. ATSC 3.0 is such a mess and devoid of anything that makes it currently better than ATSC 1.0 that it doesn't bother me that I may have to wait a very long time for HD to allow me to view all ATSC 3.0 content.

Everyone's situation is different so this post isn't meant to diminish or belittle anyone else's situation. I just happen to be blessed with a situation that allows me to be patient through all of this.

Phoenixfury
Posts: 113
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2018 5:55 am
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Re: Encryption

Post by Phoenixfury »

bakerbk64 wrote: Tue Apr 02, 2024 11:08 am Long time lurker, but had a free moment so thought I'd chime in.

I bought an HDHR 4K Flex 4K about 5 months ago. I knew then that it could not decode encrypted channels but in my situation I currently don't care and will patiently wait for the day that it can.

Here's my situation...

I live in the Kansas City metropolitan area and can get strong ATSC 1.0 signals. I have a PLEX server and enjoy the fact that I get 4 more tuners from my HDHR along with my other 2 tuners for watching/recording simultaneous shows. The PLEX sever has better recording functionality (better guide, deleting commercials, etc.) than the HDHR recording capabilities, so I use my PLEX for recording. I can also use my PLEX to view my shows outside of my house. For watching live OTA broadcasts I really like the network tuner aspect of the HDHR and use it often to watch live shows especially sports. I also have a Hisense TV that has an ATSC 3.0 tuner and handles DRM just fine. With the Hisense I am able to compare the quality of the current state of ATSC 1.0 vs ATSC 3.0, and as everyone knows in this forum, there are very little if any quality differences since there is currently no 4K OTA content. I say all of this to reinforce the fact that I can patiently await for the day that the HDHR can handle DRM. ATSC 3.0 is such a mess and devoid of anything that makes it currently better than ATSC 1.0 that it doesn't bother me that I may have to wait a very long time for HD to allow me to view all ATSC 3.0 content.

Everyone's situation is different so this post isn't meant to diminish or belittle anyone else's situation. I just happen to be blessed with a situation that allows me to be patient through all of this.
I look at it this way. Whether 3.0 bombs or not, we still have the best ATSC 1.0 tuners in a network tuner on the market. I had the Flex Quarto which displayed a noticable amount of macro blocking. (This is where video can appear blocking, especially with a lot of motion.) This is not as noticable with my Flex 4K. Reception also seems to be noticably increased too. I say it's worth the upgrade whether 3.0 takes off or not.

danieljlevine
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat Aug 05, 2023 8:26 pm

Re: Encryption

Post by danieljlevine »

In my use case in the Columbia, Maryland area, I liked the HDHR Flex 4K because I could place my antenna where I needed it and all my TVs and devices could watch using it. The basement TV benefits the most. But I also like sitting out front and on my deck in the back and watch shows on a tablet.

However much my ATSC 1.0 reception is improved over what is natively in both Samsung TVs by using the HDHR app on my FireStick 4Ks, the ATSC 3.0 reception is even better. I can watch both the ATSC 1.0 and 3.0 (non-DRM) channel on tablet and TV simultaneously to compare. So I’m not talking about resolution. I’m just talking about loss of signal. So, I can’t wait to see what happens when the ATSC 3.0 stations go to full power.

I also get a decent number of Washington, DC stations with the same antenna pointed the same way (ATSC 1.0 and 3.0 non-DRM). Those are harder to get to come in well. So I’m excited for those to go to full power someday as well.

Problem is when the ATSC 1.0 channel doesn’t want to be nice and the ATSC 3.0 channel has DRM.

I’m wondering if PBS might be the first station to deliver 4K or Dolby Atmos content in my area. At least aid get to see that and I have Dolby Atmos 5.1.2 output ready, not getting used by Amazon anymore. :-/

So yeah, I guess from me I get better signal quality from ATSC 1.0 now, even better from the ATSC 3.0 I can receive (and is not DRM) with the expectation to receive them even better at full power from the Baltimore transmitters, Washington DC transmitters, and possibly some from even further away when they are at full power.


So my real question for SD is what new features are you developing in the software for the existing users? I don’t think zone seen anything really new for a while. I’m guessing you’re not working on DRM since there’s nothing for you to do to make progress.

Things I’d like to see:

1. I’d like some information regarding the signal quality and stream properties for the channel (like Channels produces) in your app. I’d also like to get it for DRM channels so I could at least know how well I’m receiving the signal, if that’s possible.
2. If I select a DRM channel, can it offer to send me to the equivalent ATSC 1.0 channel, if there is one until DRM is supported?

raypenj
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2023 6:58 pm

Re: Encryption

Post by raypenj »

So, by now, perhaps everyone has seen the A3SA announcement from Feb 26th. https://a3sa.com/annoucements/

I think owners of the Flex" 4K (myself included) could be forgiven for getting excited by much of the language in the release.
"A new digital video recorder (DVR) specification is now available to licensees of the A3SA content protection technology that is now being deployed throughout the country concurrent with the launch of NEXTGEN TV broadcast channels. "
“For the past year, we’ve been working in consultation with several electronics companies who are developing devices designed to add new features for NEXTGEN TV viewers, from simple DVRs to more advanced home networking systems. After considering the various home scenarios, A3SA is pleased to release detailed specifications that will guide companies and soon provide consumers with a wealth of new options for digital video recording and more,” said Ron Wheeler, managing director of A3SA.
"A3SA approved the new specifications and rules for secure DVRs, home gateways, and other accessory devices, as well as a newly added alternative method to let viewers securely stream ATSC 3.0 content from such devices throughout their home network. "
I don't believe there was an official response from SD to this announcement yet, except perhaps NedS saying it's nothing new. "I said Nick would provide details, but the short answer was that A3SA did not release anything new. They took a draft spec and published it, and it is still missing all the steps for *how* things are supposed to work."

Ultimately, the A3SA announcement makes it look like things are ready to go, e.g. "detailed specification". But there are indeed two definitions of "specification"

1. an act of describing or identifying something precisely or of stating a precise requirement.
2. a detailed description of the design and materials used to make something

I think most of us owners were hoping it was definition #2, but perhaps A3SA is falling back on definition #1, i.e. here are the rules you need to meet, good luck in getting there.

Is this a correct assessment of the situation?

If so, it seems perhaps the most promising direction is Google Widevine on Android boxes right now(?) Nick mentioned there was "activity" on this front.

Lastly, is SiliconDust currently a licensee of the A3SA content protection technology that was mentioned in the press release?

Cabal
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Re: Encryption

Post by Cabal »

raypenj wrote: Thu Apr 04, 2024 5:20 pm I don't believe there was an official response from SD to this announcement yet, except perhaps NedS saying it's nothing new.
I take this as an official, and very thorough, response:

viewtopic.php?p=398657#p398657

jasonl
Silicondust
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Re: Encryption

Post by jasonl »

A longer response is coming from Nick. He's been busy with prep for NAB among other things.

jeffdafoe
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Re: Encryption

Post by jeffdafoe »

RickD_99 wrote: Mon Mar 25, 2024 3:46 pm I believe instead of pestering Nick or Ned about “updates” the better question is when is SD going to start playing hardball and get the lawyers involved in this situation?
Taking that route would just be a gigantic money sink.

-Jeff

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