Encryption

[NedS]

How is A3SA able to prevent the recording of any of the OTA (free public airwaves) programming if the courts have already ruled that consumers can record content for personal use? Isn't this the same reason we have DVR's today?

https://legalbeagle.com/6696968-tv-reco ... -laws.html

The evil backdoor of the DCMA. It's only legal as long as you're not breaking DRM.

[NedS]

Does subscription free OTA broadcast only apply to the primary channels that a broadcaster submits to the FCC for a license. Does it apply to sub-channels?


https://www.streamtvinsider.com/video/s ... w-revenues

it applies to both the main as well as the subs that a broadcaster is broadcasting.

I believe the encryption requirement was relaxed, and now main and sub-channels can be encrypted. I'm not sure about subscription channels.

[joblo]

“We plan to offer broadcasters the ability to block the user from viewing the channel via their home network.”


This is the current situation, mission accomplished! If I can’t view it, none of the rest even matters.Why waste the electrons?

Thank you for noticing! I've been wondering how long it would be before someone commented on this.

@nickk and/or @NedS, what is the point of this exercise if you plan to effectively give broadcasters a kill switch to disable viewing their channels?

Especially in light of the following:

Something to keep in mind with DRM - specific broadcasters fought hard for the ATSC 1.0 "broadcast flag" which was a flag telling a DVR to disable recording. And some channels broadcast this flag 24/7

What makes you think there will not be at least some broadcasters that disable viewing by home network 24/7?

And given the early history of the DRM rollout, why should any potential SD customer trust their local broadcasters won't be among those disabling viewing of their channels?

And what recourse would you or any of your customers have if a competitor of yours required your devices to be thus disabled as a condition of advertising on a station or group of stations?

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Bottom line, it seems to me that A3SA has to be 100% on board with AT LEAST allowing VIEWING of non-pay DRM channels over a home network, or there really isn't any point in wasting any more time, money, and energy on this. (as @ericdsa suggests)

What are we missing?

[foxbat121]

What are we missing?

If you want to get DRM certification from A3SA, you need to implement everything they told you to implement. You don't get to pick and choose.

Whether or not DRM is allowed in public airwaves, that is a separate political matter that only FCC can tackle when they feel like to handle many years later.

If you don't follow current A3SA roles, you don't get DRM certification. Simple as that. Broadcasters will continue to force DRM until they told not allowed to by FCC. To broadcasters, it is just a simple flip of switch. But to companies like SD, it is life or death situation. You either play with the existing rules or leave this ATSC 3.0 business.

[freway01]

What are we missing?

If you want to get DRM certification from A3SA, you need to implement everything they told you to implement. You don't get to pick and choose.

Whether or not DRM is allowed in public airwaves, that is a separate political matter that only FCC can tackle when they feel like to handle many years later.

If you don't follow current A3SA roles, you don't get DRM certification. Simple as that. Broadcasters will continue to force DRM until they told not allowed to by FCC. To broadcasters, it is just a simple flip of switch. But to companies like SD, it is life or death situation. You either play with the existing rules or leave this ATSC 3.0 business.

First, do we even know if nickk and the SD can meet all of the A3SA requirements, and if they can, will this solution be able to be added to existing 4K Flex gateways we already own, or will we need to buy a new gateway?

Second, you are right, it is a political matter and if we don't keep submitting comments in support of Lon Seidman's petition (16-142) to the FCC, and contact our Congressional representatives letting them know how the FCC isn't doing their job because they are allowing the big TV broadcasters to make up the rules on how they use 'our' 'free' public airwaves which will take away or make it too expensive for consumers to record what is supposed to be 'free' TV', like we do today. Companies like SD & Tab*o who manufactures todays ATSC 1.0 gateway tuner/DVR devices that are being used by millions of consumers, helping us save money by not having to buy a multi-tuner DVR devices for each TV, are being forced to invest a lot time and money to meet some very strict requirements to decode encrypted ATSC 3.0 signals that aren't required to day with the ATSC 1.0 signals.

[nickk]

What are we missing?

If you want to get DRM certification from A3SA, you need to implement everything they told you to implement. You don't get to pick and choose.

Whether or not DRM is allowed in public airwaves, that is a separate political matter that only FCC can tackle when they feel like to handle many years later.

If you don't follow current A3SA roles, you don't get DRM certification. Simple as that. Broadcasters will continue to force DRM until they told not allowed to by FCC. To broadcasters, it is just a simple flip of switch. But to companies like SD, it is life or death situation. You either play with the existing rules or leave this ATSC 3.0 business.

This.

[joblo]

This.

So again I ask: what is the point of DRM certification if it doesn't guarantee that HDHR users can at least view DRM-encrypted channels live?

Unless you plan to add HDMI outputs or provide dongles as @DSperber suggests, I don't see the point.

(Note also that insofar as SD is at the mercy of A3SA, encouraging your customers to sign petitions against what A3SA is doing is not likely to make them more cooperative.)

[nickk]

So again I ask: what is the point of DRM certification if it doesn't guarantee that HDHR users can at least view DRM-encrypted channels live?

Customers are asking for DRM support.
The current expectation is that you will be able to view DRM encrypted channels on Android and FireTV devices (only).

[zippy]

I'm good with that. All of my ATSC 3.0 stations are currently non-DRM. And I only have one new TV where the AI 4K upscaling from 1080p to 4K makes it worth the hassle

[JDazell]

Nickk and his team are simply trying to stay in the game, following the DRM rules as laid out by the governing organizations.

Continually chastising SiliconDust for trying to stay in the Gateway Tuner market by playing the hand dealt to them by ATSC 3.0 & A3SA, is really counter productive. As the creators of the HDHR platform, I am sure that Nickk and the team as more frustrated by what has unfolded in this "Next Gen" market, with the regulations and despicable DRM encryption.

Personally I am exhausted pouring through all the unnecessary comments, simply to glean the nuggets of real info and updates from the team. I believe that is why Nickk created this new thread as a place for all of the pertinent info and updates to live. If you want to continue on with all of this nonsense grandstanding, criticizing and complaining, then take it back to the original 80+ page thread. PLEASE.

So ... can we all pull back from the brink and let's try to be more understanding, more supportive and less criticizing, chastizing and complaining about the DRM Decryption steps taken to date.

Stand by and wait patiently. The state of this debacle is not of SiliconDust's doing. And based on their track record over the past two decades, they will eventually bring this over the finish line, when they are approved.

[freway01]

So again I ask: what is the point of DRM certification if it doesn't guarantee that HDHR users can at least view DRM-encrypted channels live?

Customers are asking for DRM support.
The current expectation is that you will be able to view DRM encrypted channels on Android and FireTV devices (only).

nickk,
You stated "current expectation is that you will be able to view DRM encrypted channels on Android and FireTV devices (only)" but you didn't mention anything about 'recording', is that not in the mix? Should I also assume that we will have to use the SD app to do this? What about the third party apps like Channel, and Plex if they ever get around to support ATSC 3.0?

[nickk]

You stated "current expectation is that you will be able to view DRM encrypted channels on Android and FireTV devices (only)" but you didn't mention anything about 'recording', is that not in the mix? Should I also assume that we will have to use the SD app to do this? What about the third party apps like Channel, and Plex if they ever get around to support ATSC 3.0?

Record will be supported and we expect it to be allowed by broadcasters until at least until the ATSC 1.0 cutoff based on public statements.

[freway01]

You stated "current expectation is that you will be able to view DRM encrypted channels on Android and FireTV devices (only)" but you didn't mention anything about 'recording', is that not in the mix? Should I also assume that we will have to use the SD app to do this? What about the third party apps like Channel, and Plex if they ever get around to support ATSC 3.0?

Record will be supported and we expect it to be allowed by broadcasters until at least until the ATSC 1.0 cutoff based on public statements.

Thanks nickk, but will the recording only work with the SD HDHomeRun app of wither 3rd party apps like Channels and Plex?

[nickk]

Thanks nickk, but will the recording only work with the SD HDHomeRun app of wither 3rd party apps like Channels and Plex?

The third party would need to be compliant, pay A3SA, and pay a test lab.

Also note that DRM channels are blocked from remote viewing.

[freway01]

Thanks nickk, but will the recording only work with the SD HDHomeRun app of wither 3rd party apps like Channels and Plex?

The third party would need to be compliant, pay A3SA, and pay a test lab.

Also note that DRM channels are blocked from remote viewing.

Sounds like you and the SD team know what needs to be done. But once the DRM hurdles for watching & recording are overcome,
1. Will current SD ATSC 3.0 'gateway' devices be able to be upgraded, or will it require a new device?
2. Will the 'gateway' devices like the 4K Flex function than like the Quatro 'Gateway' ATSC 1.0 device does today with the same features like 'time shifting'?
3. Will an internet connect be required at all times? This could be a problem for people who either don't have the internet, or poor/slow internet connections.
4. Plex and Channels have been great advocates for SD 'gateway' devices, are you working with them or keeping them in the loop on your progress?