Windows 10 HdHomeRun App Issues

ATSC 3.0 Forum
TBR
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Detroit ATSC 3.0 - TBR

Post by TBR »

I received my tuner from Amazon 3 days ago and have been sadly disappointed so far. My son has bought multiple SiliconeDust products (and even has this new tuner through Kickstarter although his antenna is not up yet) but did not warn me it wasn't exactly Plug-n-Play.

I'm off in the boonies: Flint, 60-70 miles from Detroit. The last time I scanned my old Hisense 4K Smart TV, I only had 73 channels. Most of the ATSC 1.0 Detroit channels come in, although 2 is iffy (broadcasts on VHF 7) on both the HDHomeRun and the various TV sets.

The ATSC 3.0 Detroit channels sometimes come in (on my Android phone). They sometimes play (without audio) on VLC on both W10 and Ubuntu 20.04. I read about the AC-4 problem, although I wonder why SD isn't pushing their own CODEC to VideoLan and elsewhere or providing transcoding options.

The HDHomeRun W10 app is another problem. The first problem is that there is no informational menu (signal strength, tuner number, tuner ID, etc.) so it is difficult to discern WHY I'm looking at a blank black screen. The second problem is that it apparently cannot play HEVC streams without a supplemental CODEC, I suspect.

I have a W10 Pro laptop (old enough not to tolerate the latest security patches without losing the fingerprint reader and other issues).
When I upgraded from W7 to W8 and lost the built-in CODECs, I downloaded a supplemental CODEC package which I assume is still installed all these years later. That machine did play the video portion of 102.1 after I installed the HEVC package through the Windows Store.

I also have three W10 Home machines that never had a CODEC supplement. Those machines just sit there and look stupid when asked to play one of the six ATSC 3.0 channels, although they also downloaded the HEVC package through the store page. It would seem that either W10 Home lacks the capability to use the provided H.265 and AC-4 CODECs OR my machines are missing CODECs the HEVC package expects to find. Since VLC can play the video portion of the HEVC stream when the HDHR app cannot, I am assuming this is not a signal-strength issue.

Then there is the Roku issue and the lack of apps for the Smart TV and the Home Theater... Plus the scattering across pages and sources of the information that I need to jump from being a dumb end-point user (where I really wanted to stay) to being a tech-savvy wizard ready to diagnose and resolve the ongoing issues.

Those who have the W10 app playing the HEVC streams: do you have any supplemental CODECs installed? Which ones?

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nickk
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Re: Detroit ATSC 3.0 - Jan 2021

Post by nickk »

Hi TBR,

The first time you access a channel with a codec that isn't installed the HDHomeRun app it will prompt you to install the needed codec from the Microsoft Store. This is the same thing Microsoft apps do.

Are you saying you didn't get a prompt to install the needed codec?

Nick

tvjay419
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Re: Detroit ATSC 3.0 - Jan 2021

Post by tvjay419 »

Nick,

I have never got a prompt to install any codecs. My audio only started working after the latest update.

Jay

TBR
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Re: Detroit ATSC 3.0 - Jan 2021

Post by TBR »

@nickk (I don't see a real tag feature on this board)

W10 Store did download and install the "HEVC Video Extensions from Device Manufacturer" v.1.0.40203.0 and "MPEG-2 Video Extension" v.1.0.22661.0 when I launched the HDHomeRun app.

Apparently the HEVC extension did not work on the W10 Home machines (and did not provide audio on the W10 Pro laptop). OR there is another unknown issue(s) preventing the HEVC channels from playing.

CBme
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Re: Detroit ATSC 3.0 - Jan 2021

Post by CBme »

TBR wrote: Fri Feb 19, 2021 1:36 pm The HDHomeRun W10 app is another problem. The first problem is that there is no informational menu (signal strength, tuner number, tuner ID, etc.) so it is difficult to discern WHY I'm looking at a blank black screen.

although I wonder why SD isn't pushing their own CODEC to VideoLan and elsewhere or providing transcoding options.
For the tuner status, it is not in the app but it is available, both on the web page for the tuner and in the Setup app.

For the tuner's web page just go it http://my.hdhomerun.com/, select the device, then then Tuner Status, then the tuner you want to look at.

For the app install the setup software https://download.silicondust.com/hdhome ... s_beta.exe
Then run the config_gui.exe and select the tuner to see what it is doing. "C:\Program Files\Silicondust\HDHomeRun\hdhomerun_config_gui.exe"

As to AC-4, there is a thread specifically about it and compatibility. To the general comment about coming up with their own codec to push out or transcode, codec packs were always risky but aren't really a thing anymore and most all 3rd party use built in open source decoders, most based on FFMpeg. It is not a priority as this amongst the first (the actual first?) device where people are receiving it and there aren't many of us yet. There is already a example of working decoder so hopefully we will see it incorporated into FFMpeg and then into the 3rd party players and transcoding software like Plex.

TBR
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Re: Detroit ATSC 3.0 - Jan 2021

Post by TBR »

@CBme

I have seen the tuner status on the my.hdhomerun.com page link (although I prefer jumping directly to the tuner's IP) and was looking for the hdhomerun_config_gui.exe (I did find a snap for Ubuntu, but it appears quite old and refuses to address past channel 69), so thanks for that link.

My experience as a "user" is that it is quite disconcerting that the app "just sits there" as a black screen. While writing this reply, I just opened the system log for the first time and discovered that the tuner apparently is rejecting requests:
20210220-00:38:59 Tuner: tuner1 tuning 107.1 WXYZ (atsc3:575MHz-3)
20210220-00:39:05 HTTP: rejecting request from 192.168.1.168 - no video data
20210220-00:39:05 Tuner: tuner1 http stream ended (requested time reached)
If the W10 app displayed something ("weak signal" or preferably the signal strength) then I could blame the weather.

Speaking of the weather, it is a sunny day here. Only the 120.99 Mobile channel is coming in (sporadically), and the W10 app did play it. I am refraining from installing any additional software until the signal improves in case what I do affects the W10 app.

I have also read the AC-4 thread and some of the discussion on FFMpeg and have downloaded (though not installed yet) ferrellsl's VideoPlayer https://github.com/ferrellsl/VideoPlaye ... s/tag/v1.1 from github. I had considered splitting my input across threads on this forum, but considered I should work on video before I worried about audio.

Sorry about any formatting issues. I am using Firefox and the buttons are just pushing HTML codes, I don't have the time to learn how to post a nice copy.

TBR
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Re: Detroit ATSC 3.0 - Jan 2021

Post by TBR »

Update: The sun has set and the signals are stronger.

The W10 app DID play the HEVC channels with video and audio on this W10 Home machine (before it closed unexpectedly). The signal was broken up, which could have caused a buffer error in the app. Speaking of buffer, the black-screen-wait is awfully long when the app tunes to an HEVC channel. I still have not installed any additional programs on this machine so the app problems lie in handling low signals.

I have read that all the Detroit ATSC 3.0 channels are being broadcast from the WMYD tower and am under that impression that the ATSC 1.0 WMYD channels are actually being broadcast from another station's tower. That prevents me from comparing the two standards. Many of my concerns could be caused by low-power signals that will improve once the stations start broadcasting from their own towers.

Does anyone have information as to how strong the signals must be (as reported by the tuner) for 1) the tuner to output a stream and 2) the tuner to output a high-quality stream?

TBR
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Re: Detroit ATSC 3.0 - Jan 2021

Post by TBR »

Re-update

I jumped on another W10 Home machine and the HDHomeRun app WILL NOT play the HEVC channels (just a black screen) while VLC gives a wonderful video stream.

The log contains the following entries for this session:
20210221-00:10:24 Tuner: tuner0 tuning 120.99 WMYDMOB (atsc3:575MHz-2)
20210221-00:10:28 Tuner: tuner0 streaming http to 192.168.1.161:59959

The app is apparently receiving the stream but is not playing it. Obviously I am shooting in the dark and do not possess the tools or knowledge to diagnose the issue...

A few minutes later...
I just downloaded and installed the ferrellsl VideoPlayer on the machine, it does play 107.1 with audio and video. The HDHomeRun app still won't play the HEVC channels, although it plays the HD channels.

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nickk
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Re: Detroit ATSC 3.0 - Jan 2021

Post by nickk »

TBR wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 5:55 pm I jumped on another W10 Home machine and the HDHomeRun app WILL NOT play the HEVC channels (just a black screen) while VLC gives a wonderful video stream.
What GPU / graphics does the machine have?

Nick

TBR
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Re: Detroit ATSC 3.0 - Jan 2021

Post by TBR »

@nickk

This (non-HEVC-playing) machine has a Radeon RX580 card. The other W10 Home just had integrated graphics with Radeon software.

I just checked the third W10 Home machine (also with integrated graphics). HEVC does not play although the tuner did stream to it.

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nickk
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Re: Detroit ATSC 3.0 - Jan 2021

Post by nickk »

Try installing the paid version ($0.99) of the Microsoft HEVC codec:
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/hevc- ... verviewtab

TBR
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Windows 10 HdHomeRun App Issues

Post by TBR »

I am experiencing various issues with the Windows 10 HDHomeRun app trying to play HEVC (ATSC 3.0) channels. These vary by machine (I have 4 W10 computers): one machine plays both audio and video (now--I don't know why it suddenly started working), one machine only plays video, and two machines just display a black screen although the tuner log states that there is a stream.

I am in a fringe area with varying signal quality, which makes it difficult to discern where the bugs are hiding.

I started discussing my concerns on the Detroit ATSC 3.0 thread, but my problems appear more related to the app than the tuner or the broadcast stream, which do play via a prototype video player at https://github.com/ferrellsl/VideoPlaye ... s/tag/v1.1

I will be posting more details regarding the hardware and software on the various machines once I collect that information.

TBR
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Re: Detroit ATSC 3.0 - Jan 2021

Post by TBR »

nickk wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 8:02 pm Try installing the paid version ($0.99) of the Microsoft HEVC codec
Nick, this issue is confused enough. The device-manufacturer version does work now on one machine and provides video on another. It might help to narrow down the problem area before I add even more variables to the mix.

I can watch the Detroit channels (when the signal is adequate) via that VideoPlayer app. Since my concerns appear larger than the Detroit area, I started a new "Windows 10 HdHomeRun App Issues" thread to address them. Let me collect some details about my various machines and I will post them on that thread.

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nickk
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Re: Windows 10 HdHomeRun App Issues

Post by nickk »

I sounds like the issue is that you were not prompted to install the Microsoft HEVC codec which should have happened automatically.

Re-testing here...

TBR
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Re: Windows 10 HdHomeRun App Issues

Post by TBR »

nickk wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 8:40 am I sounds like the issue is that you were not prompted to install the Microsoft HEVC codec which should have happened automatically.
The prompt occurred and that codec did install on all machines. See details below.

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