ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - 2020

ATSC 3.0 Forum
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stalecheetos
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by stalecheetos »

larrywhite wrote: Thu Dec 31, 2020 5:52 pm I'm over in Bremerton on top of a hill and all my numbers are at 100% for 31.
Pretty much a straight shot to Seattle.
Thanks for confirming. I'm in north Seattle and can see the towers on Queen Anne. I'll have to check my antenna tomorrow.

stalecheetos
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by stalecheetos »

I'm getting Fox on 22.2 in 720p now. Obviously not ASTC3, but when did that start?

CBme
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by CBme »

stalecheetos wrote: Thu Dec 31, 2020 5:30 pm Is anyone having signal quality issues with the ATSC3 channels on 31?

I received my connect 4k today and was really hoping this would allow me to finally receive Q13 without the signal breaking up, but no luck. Symbol quality drops to 0 anytime someone drives by. I'm surprised by that because KONG was solid previously.

If KONG was good for you before, it should still be but if it isn't, KUNS shouldn't be either which would seem like an antenna location issue (or something else like an amplifier on the line that needs to be turned off). I'm getting 100% strength and quality from in Kirkland. For the current 3.0 broadcasts, KONG's antenna (KING, KZJO, KCPQ) in Seattle only a block away from KUNS (KOMO, KIRO) and you should be able to aim very directly at both. ATSC 1 to 3 reception should be the same. The piece that is supposed to be better is something like the car driving by or other temporary interruptions that shouldn't cause 3.0 to fail (as easily as 1.0) Though that may still work once you figure out why you are having such bad reception to start with.

CH31
https://www.rabbitears.info/tower.php?r ... rn=1032128

CH24
https://www.rabbitears.info/tower.php?r ... rn=1032456

You should have a very different experience with 13 on 1.0 vs 3.0 due to the antenna locations. ATSC 1.0 Ch13 vhf antenna is west of Bremerton and might be harder to pick up without a 'omnidirectional' antenna at your location given most antennas would be due south and that would be mostly west.
https://www.rabbitears.info/tower.php?r ... rn=1049708
Last edited by CBme on Thu Dec 31, 2020 10:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

CBme
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by CBme »

stalecheetos wrote: Thu Dec 31, 2020 10:40 pm I'm getting Fox on 22.2 in 720p now. Obviously not ASTC3, but when did that start?
You should see Fox on 13 and that is the 3.0 station and will play from tuner 0&1. The 22.2 is the 1.0 simulcast that will play from tuner 2&3. It went up at 720p when they shuffled everything around for the 3.0 launch on the 15th.

alikaz
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by alikaz »

Hello, I'll chime in with my results as well. I don't see anyone having the exact same results as me, I'm in Bothell WA. Pre Dec 15 everything was working great except 13-1 which was having intermittent dropouts for me which it didn't before. After Dec 15 these are the problems I have:

I am still seeing KIRO and KOMO come up as atsc1 which looks pretty common. Both those stations are playing fine through hdhomerun apps and plex as atsc1.

My main problem is the new HEVC streams, I get no sound on any of my devices except 1. I've tried this on a 6th gen intel laptop (windows 10), Intel Xeon desktop (windows 10), roku ultra (2017), and a Motorola edge+ (2020, running Android 10) using the hdhomerun app and there is no sound. Also my Plex install will tune the channels, but no audio track is recognized. I've updated the hdhomerun app and also installed the MPEG-2 and "HEVC Video extensions from device manufacturer" and still the same result. But very interestingly it does work fine on only 1 of my devices, an intel 8th gen laptop (Thinkpad T480, windows 10).

I don't have any other problems such as dropouts or freezing as of yet, just this no-audio issue. On the HDHomerun apps i can click SAP and it shows English 5.1 as the first channel and SAP stereo as the 2nd, no sound on either.

edit: my hdhomerun 4k is still on 1030 firmware and it says it's up to date, I've tried rebooting it. I see others here have a December version? Is there a way to force an update?

stalecheetos
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by stalecheetos »

Aside from known issues, everything on the KUNS transmitter (RF24) is solid. That was another reason that made me wonder about the KONG transmission. I'm going to check the antenna today.
CBme wrote: Thu Dec 31, 2020 10:49 pm
If KONG was good for you before, it should still be but if it isn't, KUNS shouldn't be either which would seem like an antenna location issue (or something else like an amplifier on the line that needs to be turned off). I'm getting 100% strength and quality from in Kirkland. For the current 3.0 broadcasts, KONG's antenna (KING, KZJO, KCPQ) in Seattle only a block away from KUNS (KOMO, KIRO) and you should be able to aim very directly at both. ATSC 1 to 3 reception should be the same. The piece that is supposed to be better is something like the car driving by or other temporary interruptions that shouldn't cause 3.0 to fail (as easily as 1.0) Though that may still work once you figure out why you are having such bad reception to start with.

stalecheetos
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by stalecheetos »

Yep, I see 13.1 as the ATSC 3 from RF31 but it's not stable.

For the old ASTC1 signal I don't get anything on RF13 from the gold mountain transmitter, only on RF22 from the Capitol Hill translator, but it has multipath issues anytime a car drives by or a plane flies over. Interestingly KZJO is perfectly stable so the 22.2 simulcast of Fox is fine, glad to see it's in 720p now.
CBme wrote: Thu Dec 31, 2020 10:53 pm You should see Fox on 13 and that is the 3.0 station and will play from tuner 0&1. The 22.2 is the 1.0 simulcast that will play from tuner 2&3. It went up at 720p when they shuffled everything around for the 3.0 launch on the 15th.

CBme
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by CBme »

dupe
Last edited by CBme on Fri Jan 01, 2021 1:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

CBme
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by CBme »

CBme wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 1:50 pm
alikaz wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 11:39 am Hello, I'll chime in with my results as well. I don't see anyone having the exact same results as me, I'm in Bothell WA. Pre Dec 15 everything was working great except 13-1 which was having intermittent dropouts for me which it didn't before. After Dec 15 these are the problems I have:
I am still seeing KIRO and KOMO come up as atsc1 which looks pretty common. Both those stations are playing fine through hdhomerun apps and plex as atsc1.
ch24 (KIRO & KOMO) dropped from scans when they made some changes on the 22nd. If you want to see your reception for these channels, see my post a few up about how to do this in the config_gui.
alikaz wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 11:39 am My main problem is the new HEVC streams, I get no sound on any of my devices except 1. I've tried this on a 6th gen intel laptop (windows 10), Intel Xeon desktop (windows 10), roku ultra (2017), and a Motorola edge+ (2020, running Android 10) using the hdhomerun app and there is no sound. Also my Plex install will tune the channels, but no audio track is recognized. I've updated the hdhomerun app and also installed the MPEG-2 and "HEVC Video extensions from device manufacturer" and still the same result. But very interestingly it does work fine on only 1 of my devices, an intel 8th gen laptop (Thinkpad T480, windows 10).
I don't have any other problems such as dropouts or freezing as of yet, just this no-audio issue. On the HDHomerun apps i can click SAP and it shows English 5.1 as the first channel and SAP stereo as the 2nd, no sound on either.
Sound will likely be a common challenge depending on device for some time. My desktop is able to support playback but our laptop does not. Xbox One and Shield can play it but on all devices the 5.1 audio is mostly jammed into one speaker. You'll want to monitor the AC-4 thread, and contribute as appropriate, for this topic as it applies to everyone.
alikaz wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 11:39 am edit: my hdhomerun 4k is still on 1030 firmware and it says it's up to date, I've tried rebooting it. I see others here have a December version? Is there a way to force an update?
That is the newest firmware. December versions refer to the players. Player versions fixed a lot of issues like crashing and stuttering. The firmware update (this week?) is what we are waiting on to address issues like the Ch24 missing in the scan. viewtopic.php?f=133&t=74778
Last edited by CBme on Mon Jan 04, 2021 10:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

CBme
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by CBme »

stalecheetos wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 12:42 pm Yep, I see 13.1 as the ATSC 3 from RF31 but it's not stable.
For the old ASTC1 signal I don't get anything on RF13 from the gold mountain transmitter, only on RF22 from the Capitol Hill translator, but it has multipath issues anytime a car drives by or a plane flies over. Interestingly KZJO is perfectly stable so the 22.2 simulcast of Fox is fine, glad to see it's in 720p now.
Ah, I hadn't thought about 22.2 not coming from their standard tower as I was only thinking about the atsc 3 locations. Capitol hill antenna is most definitely a better location.

For CH31, are you seeing issues with all of the channels or just KCPQ? I'm assuming all are bad but you just mentioned 13. Signal and symbol bad to start with (signal jamming cars)? What is your antenna setup and do you have any amplifiers on the line?
Certainly sucks to be closer than most but have worse reception challenges.

stalecheetos
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by stalecheetos »

CBme wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 2:06 pm Ah, I hadn't thought about 22.2 not coming from their standard tower as I was only thinking about the atsc 3 locations. Capitol hill antenna is most definitely a better location.
The capitol hill translator on RF22 is pretty low power though, so thankfully the fox simulcast on the KZJOtransmitter (RF36) is not.
CBme wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 2:06 pm For CH31, are you seeing issues with all of the channels or just KCPQ? I'm assuming all are bad but you just mentioned 13. Signal and symbol bad to start with (signal jamming cars)? What is your antenna setup and do you have any amplifiers on the line?
Certainly sucks to be closer than most but have worse reception challenges.
Yeah, everything from KONG (RF31) has terrible symbol quality anytime a car drives by. My antenna is a cheap uhf bowtie grid with a single dipole for vhf, I'm going to replace it and see if anything changes. Hard to imagine it's the antenna itself since KOMO ATSC1 (RF30 - 569 MHZ) and ION (RF33 - 587 MHZ) are working fine. Maybe I will have to move the antenna to another location and see if anything changes.

CBme
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by CBme »

stalecheetos wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 2:45 pm Yeah, everything from KONG (RF31) has terrible symbol quality anytime a car drives by. My antenna is a cheap uhf bowtie grid with a single dipole for vhf, I'm going to replace it and see if anything changes. Hard to imagine it's the antenna itself since KOMO ATSC1 (RF30 - 569 MHZ) and ION (RF33 - 587 MHZ) are working fine. Maybe I will have to move the antenna to another location and see if anything changes.
Yeah, that would be strange if it was an issue with the antenna if the 24 and the others are good as both are UHF in frequencies you don't seem to have a problem with, blocks from each other, you are physically (comparatively) close, and they are full power (to my knowledge). Though is why I mentioned an amplifier as if you have one of those on the line, it could be causing the problem if it is on. When I turn on the one that came with my ANTOP AT-400BV some channels start having issues with signal and quality that didn't before. Likely it just makes it too hot in my case. KONG/31 is listed as 679kw vs 625kw for KUNS so it is certainly a little hotter to start with.
Do you have the ability to move where yours is? Like into an attic or somewhere else on the same floor that might not be getting the same reflection/other issue? I'm just very curious as to why you are having issues given other channels being fine and my understanding that 3.0 is supposed to improve things like multipath problems (assuming your issue is related).

jmcgeejr
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by jmcgeejr »

Anyone know why Kiro and Komo are still just ATSC 1? I saw them as 3 a week or two ago and been back to 1 since then. I will add that ATSC 3 really made a difference with quality for me, before I would get cutouts during windy/rainy days on most channels (I have a channel master directional up on the roof), and now with atsc 3 I get none of those.

CBme
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by CBme »

jmcgeejr wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:55 pm Anyone know why Kiro and Komo are still just ATSC 1? I saw them as 3 a week or two ago and been back to 1 since then. I will add that ATSC 3 really made a difference with quality for me, before I would get cutouts during windy/rainy days on most channels (I have a channel master directional up on the roof), and now with atsc 3 I get none of those.
Yup, unfortunately you missed a key post from last week highlighting that you do not want to do a rescan.. ;-) Net is they made an update to the broadcast on Monday 21st and HDHomerun hasn't been able to pick them up in the guide scan since. You can tune ch24 manually with the Config_Gui. Upcoming firmware may address the issue.
viewtopic.php?p=368032#p368032

Glad to hear that at least one of the promises of the tech seems to be working for you. Doesn't seem to be helping stalecheetos as cars passing by are killing his signal but there may be something else going on with that issue.
Last edited by CBme on Sun Jan 03, 2021 3:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

breakout
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Seattle / Tacoma - Dec 15th launch

Post by breakout »

This weeks football update:

Watching using most current app on Shield. Still defaulted to SAP, however, I was successfully able to change to english 5.1. The only issue, is that the audio channels are off. The commentary is coming from my rears, and I only have "crowd" noise in the center.

Happy to run a sample pull.

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