ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

ATSC 3.0 Forum
nickk
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by nickk »

Snapshot video - can you please do a 30s capture of the channel:
http://hdhomerun.local:5004/auto/v102.1 ... uration=30

If you have more than one HDHomeRun device replace "hdhomerun.local" with the Device ID ".local".
Replace v102.1 with the problem channel number.

Once saved please upload to a service like Google Drive and PM me the share link.

Nick

kyl416
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by kyl416 »

stever40@yahoo.com wrote: Fri Aug 06, 2021 6:11 am Has anyone been able to get a 4k resolution on the ATSC 3.0 channels? I tried with the Olympics and looks like WESH 102.1 is still sending a 1080 signal and not a 2160 signal. I verified resolution in the Channels app on Apple TV 4K by turning on the "stats".
NBCU's 4K coverage is limited to select cable/telco, satellite and streaming providers:
www.nbcolympics.com/4k

No one has the Olympics in 4K over the air since there's not enough bandwidth for 4K when you have multiple HD channels sharing the market's ATSC 3.0 signals. Plus none of the NBC O&Os currently have ATSC 3.0 signals, so NBC isn't going to offer something for OTA affilates that none of their own stations can show over the air.

DougHo
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by DougHo »

nickk wrote: Fri Aug 06, 2021 8:38 am Snapshot video - can you please do a 30s capture of the channel:
http://hdhomerun.local:5004/auto/v102.1 ... uration=30

If you have more than one HDHomeRun device replace "hdhomerun.local" with the Device ID ".local".
Replace v102.1 with the problem channel number.

Once saved please upload to a service like Google Drive and PM me the share link.

Nick
Is that something you want anyone in Orlando to do? Would capture (using PC) be helpful, since the problem is just with HDHomeRun on the iPad? Same channels work fine with HDHomeRun on Windows 10 and/or Channels app on same iPad.

alaz
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Location: Space Coast, FL (Orlando area)

Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by alaz »

Been following this for a while; the problems are the same with me. iPad Gen 6, iPhone 8, iMac 2017 (well loaded), EXTEND and FLEX 4K tuners, HDHomeRun DVR. HDHomeRun does not work properly for ATSC 3.0 (Orlando area) on any of my devices. Channels does real-time viewing only, but not available for iMac. As I understand, audio needs either new Apple gear (very expensive), or perhaps ffmpeg with fixes? I have to learn how to do that, and for which devices will it work? But all Orlando ATSC channels a HD and not 4K (yet)?

1. Can HDHomeRun include audio drivers, just like Channels does? Is this possible / in the works?

2. Jumpy, one image every second or so on some channels. Has someone sent the 30 sec clip to Nick? I'm assuming that someone has already.

3. Realistically, 4K makes little sense for iPhone or iPad, but the iMac does have the resolution for 4K.

Is this an accurate assessment of this entire thread? What can I do to help?

Thank you all, HDHomeRun and all users active in this thread!

- Andy

nickk
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by nickk »

alaz wrote: Wed Aug 11, 2021 7:17 pm 2. Jumpy, one image every second or so on some channels. Has someone sent the 30 sec clip to Nick? I'm assuming that someone has already.
Not yet - if we get a capture we can replay it through our QA system and hopefully reproduce the problem.

Nick

nickk
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by nickk »

DougHo wrote: Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:23 pm Is that something you want anyone in Orlando to do? Would capture (using PC) be helpful, since the problem is just with HDHomeRun on the iPad? Same channels work fine with HDHomeRun on Windows 10 and/or Channels app on same iPad.
Capture is done using a web browser - best on a Mac or PC.

Nick

stever40@yahoo.com
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by stever40@yahoo.com »

kyl416 wrote: Fri Aug 06, 2021 9:58 am
stever40@yahoo.com wrote: Fri Aug 06, 2021 6:11 am Has anyone been able to get a 4k resolution on the ATSC 3.0 channels? I tried with the Olympics and looks like WESH 102.1 is still sending a 1080 signal and not a 2160 signal. I verified resolution in the Channels app on Apple TV 4K by turning on the "stats".
NBCU's 4K coverage is limited to select cable/telco, satellite and streaming providers:
www.nbcolympics.com/4k

No one has the Olympics in 4K over the air since there's not enough bandwidth for 4K when you have multiple HD channels sharing the market's ATSC 3.0 signals. Plus none of the NBC O&Os currently have ATSC 3.0 signals, so NBC isn't going to offer something for OTA affilates that none of their own stations can show over the air.
Thanks. Great explanation.

alaz
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by alaz »

OK, Nick, I'll do it over the weekend (soon) and send it. Some projects require cramming a one hour effort into a week -- and never give advance notice. ;-) But this seems pretty straightforward. There are two issues I'll try to bring up: 1. The staccato one frame per second, 2. Noise on the Hi-V (high end of the old VHF allocations) that could be due to any of a bunch of reasons. Thanks for you constant support and work! - Andy

alaz
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Location: Space Coast, FL (Orlando area)

Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by alaz »

I'll use a standard video capture on my workhorse iMac.

alaz
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Location: Space Coast, FL (Orlando area)

Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by alaz »

Nick, organized some information for you; not exactly what I expected....

There are six channels on two frequencies in Orlando FL.

WESH 102.1, WKCF 118.1, WUCF 135.1 -- all at 201.000 MHz (Hi-VHF) --
WKMG 106.1, WOFL 135.1, WRBW 165.1 -- all at 557.000 MHz (UHF)

Hi-VHF behaviors on iMac (2017, loaded): video noisy, no audio; iPad(2018) & iPhone8 video at 1 frame/sec, no audio
UHF behaviors on iMac, iPad, iPhone: good video, no audio
DVR recording play back the same behavior as in real time (spot checks so far).
Apple TV not yet tested (will send later).

I recorded 1 min of video on DVR, 580 MB! Something is wrong, I will review, re-do. But this recording only shows pixelated noise in the video.

If you want, I will redo video capture on iMac, and can capture video of iPad/iPhone 1 frame/sec issue using external camera. Let me know if you want those, given the above info.

Channels 3rd party app on iPad, iPhone, Apple TV all show good video and audio on all channels. No app for iMac.

As I understand none of the local TV HEVC channels broadcast 4K yet; only HD.

Tentative conclusion based on above: Antanna and OTA network in house working well. EXTEND has been and is working well. FLEX 4K working well in HD and HEVC modes (per Channels performance). Tuners are delivering video and audio properly. The iPad and iPhone can't display 4K anyway, so it's about whether then can decode the HEVC and downgrade; that's not working now.

Because the video and audio work well on Channels to other devices, those signals are probably being delivered properly to the iMac.

Only the Hi-VHF channels have video problems, they are likely weaker signals at 35 miles distance to towers.

If local broadcasts are limited to HD for now, it's possible the Channels switches to HD mode, whereas HDHomeRun tries to use HEVC and is downsampled to device resolution?

Audio has been reported to work on iMacs 2018+; my iMac is 2017. Channels must include an audio decoder for ATSC 3.0 channels, whereas HDHomeRun does not.

Bottom line: The above strongly suggests that the video issues can be addressed in HDHomeRun software. HDHomeRun seems to depend on audio decoders being in the user's hardware, but for iMacs 4 years old and older, they need audio decoders. It's possible the the upcoming Apple MacOS major upgrade to Monterey might include the audio fix.

Let me know if you still want the video clips. I cannot reproduce the 1 frame/sec on my iMac.

Thank you! - Andy

alaz
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Location: Space Coast, FL (Orlando area)

Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by alaz »

Apple TV 4K -> Yamaha receiver (includes 4K, before ATSC) -> Panasonic HD plasma

Yeah,old TV, but at 50" size and the room it's in, there is not much advantage to 4K, and plasma has great contrast (much better than the older LCDs). We will update that soon....

HDHomeRun
High-VHF channels: video at the approx. 1 frame / sec; audio good
UHF channels: video good, audio good

Channels: Both High-VHF and UHF channels: video good, audio good

What is interesting here is that all components, Apple TV, receiver and TV are all pre-ATSC, and the audio works in both HDHomeRun and Channels.

alaz
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Location: Space Coast, FL (Orlando area)

Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by alaz »

Possible MacOS audio fix. Taken from Internet instructions. I have not yet done this, as this won't fix the video pixelated noise issue. FYI -- NOT TESTED

Open MacOS Terminal: # are comments if copied into a script.

# Install FFmpeg (needed for HEVC and ATSC audio)

# Install brew

/bin/bash -c "$(curl -fsSL https://raw.githubusercontent.com/Homeb ... install.sh)"

# Follow on-screen instructions
brew install ffmpeg

# Install ffmpeg
brew tap homebrew-ffmpeg/ffmpeg
brew install homebrew-ffmpeg/ffmpeg/ffmpeg

# To upgrade ffmpeg

brew update && brew upgrade ffmpeg

# Use the -tag:v hvc1 parameter in your FFmpeg command make your HEVC file work on Apple devices.
ffmpeg -i input.avi -c:v libx265 -crf 28 -c:a aac -b:a 128k -tag:v hvc1 output.mp4

alaz
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Location: Space Coast, FL (Orlando area)

Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by alaz »

Nick,

Finally, got it together: Three links to videos on Google Drive

First two show what my iMac sees (video pixelated noise, no audio)

As you requested in this thread for a 30 second recording:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1JDs_RK ... sp=sharing

A screen video recording from my iMac of the same channel
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1eG5wee ... sp=sharing

Third shows a camera recording of the same channel on Apple TV, ~1 frame/second, good audio
I don't have a way to do a direct screen recording, but it shows the problem.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1JjsHtW ... sp=sharing

Hope these help. Let me know what I can do to help.

- Andy

nowknown
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Re: ATSC 3.0: Orlando, FL

Post by nowknown »

I was getting the picture frame studder every ten seconds on CBS, FOX, and NBC (LG OLED SD SMART APP) and now it is only on NBC. Is this a broadcast issue?

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