When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

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NedS
Silicondust
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by NedS » Mon Apr 22, 2019 11:31 pm

rpcameron wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:38 pm
I'm in SoCal with Charter/Spectrum, and none of our HD channels are H.264. While most HD streams are usually about 8Mbps, I have seen them up to 15Mbps or so at times. While that's only 90Mbps, it's still quite a bit of bandwidth and could cause some issues, especially if you are streaming 6 HD sports streams. I can't figure out why they chose to go with 100Mbps, whereas the original Prime has GbE.
EDIT: my bad, the original Prime was gig ethernet.

rpcameron
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by rpcameron » Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:36 am

NedS wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 11:31 pm
rpcameron wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:38 pm
I'm in SoCal with Charter/Spectrum, and none of our HD channels are H.264. While most HD streams are usually about 8Mbps, I have seen them up to 15Mbps or so at times. While that's only 90Mbps, it's still quite a bit of bandwidth and could cause some issues, especially if you are streaming 6 HD sports streams. I can't figure out why they chose to go with 100Mbps, whereas the original Prime has GbE.
The original prime is only 100 meg ethernet.
I was under the impression that the HDHR3-CC (Prime 3) was the original. If that's not the case, then I have misspoken. If you are referring that that model, then it is indeed a gigabit ethernet device.

(I know this to be the case, because it was problems when operating in gigabit mode that exposed the firmware bug, and I used to have to modify my ethernet cables to use with my Primes to force them to 100Mbps.)

NYPlayer
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by NYPlayer » Tue Apr 23, 2019 9:04 am

The original prime is 1000. I have 2 of them.

TV Tuner:
Three Digital Tuners, 1 RF input
TV Standards:
US Digital Cable
Interface:
Ethernet, M-Card CableCARD
Network:
1000baseT (gigabit Ethernet) - backwards compatible with 100baseTX networks
Dimensions:
7”(L) x 4”(W) x 1.25”(D)

signcarver
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by signcarver » Tue Apr 23, 2019 9:12 am

NedS wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 11:31 pm
The original prime is only 100 meg ethernet.
Only if by original you mean some prototype or perhaps a model that went to hauppauge for their usb tuner model, maybe... from release of the prime from silicondust, it has been gigabit as they expected use cases where 3 channels may need 114Mbps (+ some overhead). Though I agree it would be very rare for 6 streams to saturate 100Mbps, I believe because they already had gig in the prime there will be many that don't understand such as the math does not support the move when they already "stated" (by the previous release) that 3 tuners needed more than 100Mbps so 6 "certainly" will need more.

timeport
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by timeport » Tue Apr 23, 2019 1:14 pm

I will if it every comes out, any timeframe ???

NedS
Silicondust
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by NedS » Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:11 pm

Sorry guys, I did get things mixed up in my head. The original Prime does indeed have gig ethernet.

octaviolima
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by octaviolima » Thu May 02, 2019 1:46 pm

We plan on getting at least one. We are anxiously waiting for the release.

Rickt1962
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by Rickt1962 » Thu May 02, 2019 5:35 pm

[removed by moderator]

jamesp
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by jamesp » Fri May 03, 2019 1:01 am

NedS wrote:
Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:11 pm
Sorry guys, I did get things mixed up in my head. The original Prime does indeed have gig ethernet.
I just don't understand why in 2019 anybody would build a video box that doesn't have 1Gbps. Is the cost difference from 100 Mbps that great? 1Gbps has been around for consumers for almost 20 years now.

Kendog52361
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by Kendog52361 » Fri May 03, 2019 1:20 am

jamesp wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 1:01 am
NedS wrote:
Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:11 pm
Sorry guys, I did get things mixed up in my head. The original Prime does indeed have gig ethernet.
I just don't understand why in 2019 anybody would build a video box that doesn't have 1Gbps. Is the cost difference from 100 Mbps that great? 1Gbps has been around for consumers for almost 20 years now.
From what I understand, it's basically a combination of there being, at best, limited chips that support 6 DRM/Cable channels, with cable card compatibility. That, combined with the chip chosen, having some kind of hardware limitation, limiting the network connection to 100 megabits per second. Since, many if not most cable broadcasters have been switching from the "traditional MPEG-2" to H.264, that 100 megabits per seconds network connection isn't as big of a deal. Sure, there's the likely concerns of, both not all cable companies have or are switching away from MPEG-2, such as my local cable company, as well as the coming "4K Broadcast Revolution", but that can be mitigated to various ways.

Firstly, as mentioned above, not even broadcast, let alone current "cable streams" use up the full "spectrum spread" for each channel, so with the exception of outside situations, like live sports broadcasts, it's not likely to really be an issue. Plus, while it's more my own thought, a software "fix" could be done to allow the full "spectrum spread", I can't remember how many megabits per second that is, but "artificially limit" the channel tuner number to 5 or so. As for the 4K "issue" both the above hypothetical software "fix" could work for some, plus the tuner is, as I understand it, codec agnostic, so if and when the cable companies start broadcasting 4K in, say, H.265, that would likely work with both the current "3 Tuner Prime" and the coming "6 Tuner Prime".

About the only possible issue with both the current "3 Tuner Prime" and the "6 Tuner Prime" would be with IPTV that cable companies are likely to switch to over the next 15+ years.

nateb
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by nateb » Fri May 03, 2019 2:28 pm

Ken, that's pretty close to a perfect summary. Because of the way virtually all cable companies handle their streams anymore, the odds of getting 6 concurrent 1080i mpeg-2 streams (the only way to fully flood the pipe) is basically zero. It's the irony of our times. As encoding continues to improve in efficiency, the actual need for a fat pipe becomes less, as least as long as the maximum resolution is 1080.

And you are also correct that HDHomeRun devices don't really care what codec comes through. mpeg2, h264, and h265 are all equally good to go.

Edit: And I guess to further answer Jamesp's question, the main reason people get a gig line is for either future proofing or moments in which they'll need to send more than 100Mbps of data. Based on the current state of cable, we are pretty sure we'll never actually be able to saturate even that 100Mbps pipe. 6 cable streams just can't do that. 6 1080i OTA streams can only BARELY do that, and cable companies don't like to waste bandwidth on 1080i MPEG-2 streams.

jamesp
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by jamesp » Sat May 04, 2019 4:06 am

nateb wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 2:28 pm
Edit: And I guess to further answer Jamesp's question, the main reason people get a gig line is for either future proofing or moments in which they'll need to send more than 100Mbps of data. Based on the current state of cable, we are pretty sure we'll never actually be able to saturate even that 100Mbps pipe. 6 cable streams just can't do that. 6 1080i OTA streams can only BARELY do that, and cable companies don't like to waste bandwidth on 1080i MPEG-2 streams.
You're assuming a 100Mbps line actually gives you 100Mbps of data. But that's just the raw speed of signals across the cable (layer 0). It doesn't include things like packet overhead. Sure, it's doubtful you'll ever see six channels needing 100Mbps, but how about 80?

Have you been able to saturate your protos in the lab with six streams at say 15Mbps to see if they can handle it? Your response sounds a bit theoretical.

shawn_75
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by shawn_75 » Sun May 05, 2019 10:25 am

I think when the Prime 6 comes out, a lot of people are going to find out how good (or bad) their network hardware is capable of handling, as some would say, a full pipe.

I personally chose a Cisco small business switch for my home network. It is well supported, very affordable, and feature packed. We are, after all, distributing video with these setups.

NYPlayer
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by NYPlayer » Sun May 05, 2019 10:34 am

shawn_75 wrote:
Sun May 05, 2019 10:25 am
I think when the Prime 6 comes out, a lot of people are going to find out how good (or bad) their network hardware is capable of handling, as some would say, a full pipe.

I personally chose a Cisco small business switch for my home network. It is well supported, very affordable, and feature packed. We are, after all, distributing video with these setups.
The Prime 6 only has 100 NIC I do not see how much stress that will put on any Gigabit Network Switch... A Quatro will probably stress the Network more.

Ken.F
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Re: When the Prime 6 comes out, how many are you planning on getting

Post by Ken.F » Sun May 05, 2019 11:00 am

NYPlayer wrote:
Sun May 05, 2019 10:34 am
The Prime 6 only has 100 NIC I do not see how much stress that will put on any Gigabit Network Switch... A Quatro will probably stress the Network more.
I have a spare 8-port 100Mbps switch sitting here. Maybe some day when I have no recordings scheduled I'll put it back in service and try to max it out. I'm curious how many streams it can handle before it chokes.

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