Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Reception, channel detection, network issues, CableCARD setup, etc.
rpcameron
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Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by rpcameron » Tue Apr 02, 2019 7:45 am

NedS wrote:
Mon Apr 01, 2019 10:24 pm
dinki wrote:
Mon Apr 01, 2019 12:14 pm
@neds Please do hurry. I just had more channels found. One tuner detected three new channels and the other tuner found three different new channels than the first. Annoying to say the least.

I'll continue to post when this happens to illustrate how the ability to turn off auto discovery really is necessary and not just a petty request.

Thanks
And these are channels that were previously discovered and hidden, but became unhidden?
I can't comment about his particular tuner, but in my case yes. It goes like this:
  • Channel scan
  • Disable undesired channels
  • During one of the Prime's background scans (usually about a month later) the channel is present again, and active
Personally, I believe this is a problem because there may be some communication errors with the TA (or perhaps background scans have shorter timeouts), and so channels that are available and can be manually tuned disappear from the channel listing because the background scan couldn't see them. Based upon the experience with disabled channels, it seems that channels that are no longer available as seen by the background scan are deleted from the Prime's database all together. The reason I say that is a subsequent background scan will "rediscover" a channel it couldn't see in a previous background scan, and it now appear in the channel lineup. In the case of a disabled channel, when it "reappears" its status is removed. (That means disabled channels are now active, and favorite channels are no longer favorites.)

I know this is mostly a cosmetic issue, as the channels that are "removed" from the lineup can be manually tuned. However, for applications that use the "new" HTTP API and the tuner's lineup (rather than maintaining their own), this means that channels that should be viewable and now marked as unavailable. (Well, worse than "unavailable" as they are not even present.) This doesn't cause too much grief because I have multiple tuners, so missing channels can be tuned on one of the other tuners, giving me time to do a hard reset on the misbehaving TA and force a complete rescan on the tuner with missing channels. But for a user with only a single tuner, I can see how this would become quite problematic.

(It should also be noted: this has been an issue ever since background scans were introduced. I know I first mentioned it as a problem over a year ago, but I was told nothing was wrong. This has only become more of an issue for me personally as my DVR software is now using the tuners' lineups, rather than maintaining its own lineup and guide mapping.)

nickk
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Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron 2

Post by nickk » Tue Apr 02, 2019 3:50 pm

rpcameron - you are using CableCARD whereas dinki is using OTA. The way scanning works is quite different between the two so I split your post to a new thread.

Nick

rpcameron
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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - dinki

Post by rpcameron » Tue Apr 02, 2019 4:40 pm

nickk wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 3:50 pm
rpcameron - you are using CableCARD whereas dinki is using OTA. The way scanning works is quite different between the two so I split your post to a new thread.

Nick
Well, that's exactly what you said when this thread was split from its parent.

Is this going to become another issue like the ethernet bug in the Prime that you refused to acknowledge for what seems like over a year? The same bug that involved deleted support requests and radio silence from support for several months?

rpcameron
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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by rpcameron » Tue Apr 02, 2019 4:42 pm

nickk wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 3:50 pm
rpcameron - you are using CableCARD whereas dinki is using OTA. The way scanning works is quite different between the two so I split your post to a new thread.

Nick
Well, that's exactly what you said when dinki's thread was split out from its parent. Except you split his thread out and continued the conversations from there.

Is this going to become another issue like the ethernet bug in the Prime that you refused to acknowledge for what seems like over a year? The same bug that involved deleted support requests and radio silence from support for several months?

Billi23
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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by Billi23 » Tue Apr 02, 2019 10:02 pm

I would suggest you look at http://x.x.x.x/lineup.xml?show=all&tuning where x.x.x.x is the IP of your prime.

I was saving that xml output every few days for about 6 months since last summer.

I also have a Prime and have this issue, posted about it last summer, but that thread is no longer there.

I don't use a TA and have noticed when the background scan cannot tune a channel it marks it as unsubscribed, which you can see in the xml output as <Subscribed>0</Subscribed>. When it's able to tune it again at some future date it will mark it as subscribed and enabled . If you then disable that channel <Enabled>0</Enabled>, the process repeats. The only way I have found to keep it from happening is to leave the channel enabled.

In my case, here are the frequencies for the channels that keep toggling back and forth between subscribed and not subscribed.

171 MHz - 1 other channel at this freq I subscribe to that never gets dropped, but channels 901-950 (Music Choice) get dropped/re-added
207 MHz - 8 other channels at this freq I subscribe to that never get dropped, but channel 19 gets dropped/re-added
213 MHz - 9 other channels at this freq I subscribe to that never get dropped, but channel 23 gets dropped/re-added
219 MHz - 6 channels at this freq I subscribe to and 3 get dropped/re-added, channels 17, 18 and 20 get dropped/re-added

NedS
Silicondust
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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by NedS » Wed Apr 03, 2019 12:54 am

rpcameron wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 4:42 pm
nickk wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 3:50 pm
rpcameron - you are using CableCARD whereas dinki is using OTA. The way scanning works is quite different between the two so I split your post to a new thread.

Nick
Well, that's exactly what you said when dinki's thread was split out from its parent. Except you split his thread out and continued the conversations from there.

Is this going to become another issue like the ethernet bug in the Prime that you refused to acknowledge for what seems like over a year? The same bug that involved deleted support requests and radio silence from support for several months?
I get that it might feel like that from your perspective, but the man just split a thread so it would be easier for him to follow the different bug reports, so let's all just relax.

nickk
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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by nickk » Wed Apr 03, 2019 6:42 am

The channel scan logic for CableCARD deletes user-set enable/favorite information on channels that are not found or not subscribed.

I just submitted a patch internally to make this CableCARD scan logic work like OTA where a background scan won't delete user-set information.

Nick

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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by signcarver » Wed Apr 03, 2019 9:01 am

Billi23 wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 10:02 pm
I would suggest you look at http://x.x.x.x/lineup.xml?show=all&tuning where x.x.x.x is the IP of your prime.
Such command does not "work" (as in showing tuning information) when one has a TA as the TA is responsible for all tuning requests.

In my case even if I disconnect my TA there are other potential issues as my system does not even have SD on the line when there are HD channels available and the cablecard map points to those non-existing channels (when I have a TA, the HD gets mapped to those same SD channel numbers) With PTV, I had to disable the numbers that are correct for both to avoid conflicts so one good thing about PTV going away, I no longer need to disable those channels.

rpcameron
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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by rpcameron » Wed Apr 03, 2019 11:18 am

NedS wrote:
Wed Apr 03, 2019 12:54 am
rpcameron wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 4:42 pm
nickk wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 3:50 pm
rpcameron - you are using CableCARD whereas dinki is using OTA. The way scanning works is quite different between the two so I split your post to a new thread.

Nick
Well, that's exactly what you said when dinki's thread was split out from its parent. Except you split his thread out and continued the conversations from there.

Is this going to become another issue like the ethernet bug in the Prime that you refused to acknowledge for what seems like over a year? The same bug that involved deleted support requests and radio silence from support for several months?
I get that it might feel like that from your perspective, but the man just split a thread so it would be easier for him to follow the different bug reports, so let's all just relax.
Considering my previous less-than-pleasant experiences with SiliconDust's response to support, I feel I'm entitled to my skepticism.

When repeated attempts to contact support regarding an open support ticket receive no response for months on end, I feel as if the company just doesn't care—not even a simple reply to say "We're award you are still having problems, and we're working on it."

Then, after being frustrated about the lack of response, a second ticket was opened. When referencing the previous support ticket, I was then informed that some change/modification/update was made to the support system, and my previous ticket had been deleted. (Of course, no mention was made of the repeated lack of response to queries sent to your support email.)

Throughout the process I was informed that because SD could not replicate the problem (although several other users could), there was really no problem at all. Until over a year later when a bug was mysteriously discovered.

I apologize if this comes across as rude, but I feel that my experience justifies a certain level of skepticism.

rpcameron
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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by rpcameron » Wed Apr 03, 2019 11:20 am

nickk wrote:
Wed Apr 03, 2019 6:42 am
The channel scan logic for CableCARD deletes user-set enable/favorite information on channels that are not found or not subscribed.

I just submitted a patch internally to make this CableCARD scan logic work like OTA where a background scan won't delete user-set information.

Nick
If this is what the problem was, and the solution was such a simple fix, why was such a solution never mentioned over the previous 18 months of complaints by several Prime users?

Is there any ETA on when a corrected firmware will be made available?

rpcameron
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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by rpcameron » Mon Apr 08, 2019 7:29 am

nickk wrote:
Wed Apr 03, 2019 6:42 am
The channel scan logic for CableCARD deletes user-set enable/favorite information on channels that are not found or not subscribed.

I just submitted a patch internally to make this CableCARD scan logic work like OTA where a background scan won't delete user-set information.

Nick
Any update on this? When should we expect a release from SD to fix this bug?

nickk
Silicondust
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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by nickk » Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:56 pm

The beta has just been released - to upgrade install the latest Windows or Mac beta software:
viewtopic.php?f=126&t=20613

Nick

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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by NYPlayer » Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:23 pm

nickk wrote:
Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:56 pm
The beta has just been released - to upgrade install the latest Windows or Mac beta software:
viewtopic.php?f=126&t=20613

Nick
I think the download needs to be updated.

rpcameron
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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by rpcameron » Thu Apr 11, 2019 7:22 am

nickk wrote:
Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:56 pm
The beta has just been released - to upgrade install the latest Windows or Mac beta software:
viewtopic.php?f=126&t=20613

Nick
Has the file moved, or am I looking in the wrong place. Trying to recreate your download URL, I come up with http://download.silicondust.com/hdhomer ... 0beta1.bin

Has something changed? And why is it so difficult to find direct download links for firmware files?

nickk
Silicondust
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Re: Turn off auto discovery of new channels - rpcameron

Post by nickk » Thu Apr 11, 2019 11:42 am

It will upgrade automatically from Windows or Mac when you install the software.

The manual download:
https://download.silicondust.com/hdhome ... 9beta1.bin

Nick

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