HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Reception, channel detection, network issues, CableCARD setup, etc.
signcarver
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by signcarver »

Chances are your card isn't properly paired as that would prevent tuning of drm protected channels. This most often happens with moto cards as the card needs the data id properly set in their system and the pairing process may change it but often will work with non-drm channels even if just partially paired... Cisco cards typically would have shown the issue on any encrypted channel if not fully paired.

testwerke
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by testwerke »

Good to know. It’s a moto card. Pairing menu shows the “call this number to start service” but I can’t remember if that message goes away when properly paired. It’s been so many years (WMC/Ceton era) since I originally activated it!

stuartm
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by stuartm »

Nope the call to start serviec menu always shows. you need to look at tuner and cablecard status pages to determine if it's properly paired.

paulsaz
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by paulsaz »

I recently started having a problem with only some of the Cox channels in the Phoenix market using X-Box 360 extenders. Background: Main PC is Windows 8.1 with MCE using EPG123, TV works fine on the Windows Media Center pc, but some of the channels, especially Food on channel 46 is either very choppy or has a black screen. I guess I should check all of the channels, but Weather, CNN, Locals all work ok on the Xbox. I will add that everything works fine on my Android TV boxes and on the Windows 10 app. The problem is only using the Xbox Extenders. Same problem on 2 different extenders. Changed the network card in the pc, tried new cables and switches. Also the problem happens with live or recorded programs. Does anyone have any idea?

signcarver
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by signcarver »

They recently expanded even more channels to h.264. Not sure what the cutoff date is/was but you should be (have been) able to get a STB rental for free for a year because of this change and I think if they say such offer expired I think they should honor it as they only stated to check a certain channel which didn't have DRM on it but all their channels other than locals have DRM (and even a few locals have DRM) so many were not aware that things wouldn't work. As people in other markets know protected h.264 doesn't always work especially with extenders. Here in phoenix though I hadn't noticed any that have us problems until recently (i.e. my Samsung TV never had issue with the protected h.264 channels until recently when accessed through it's dlna methods but the past few months it hasn't been able to tune any. It will be a couple of hours before I can check such out in WMC and extender myself.

CNN should be h.264, but locals, weather and espn are not (yet) and most locals aren't protected.

Edit: had a chance to test with extenders on xbox syfy worked best but still occasionally stutters but is somewhat watchable (they were one of the first to convert other than the old plus pack channels which had worked on both my xbox and ceton extenders) Food is hit or miss and when it gets a picture any major scene change pauses the stream. The new "SD" locals won't start at all on my xbox but were somewhat watchable on my ceton extenders (though often heavily pixilated, occasional green shifts, and previous images sometimes remaining on screen, but the cetons wouldn't work where the xbox somewhat did). Interesting on both some commercials played without a hitch but that was rare. Tried some of the older channels that did work (such as some HBOs that were h.264 for years) and those were also frequently stop action but picture itself looked better than it used to. On my PC's I had no issue and goes back to why I often record 4 copies of the same show and don't use extenders as often.

Watcher
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by Watcher »

signcarver wrote: Wed Jul 28, 2021 1:50 pm ... As people in other markets know protected h.264 doesn't always work especially with extenders.
As I recall, the issue with the extenders was that depending on the specific encoder and settings used by the provider(*) the H.264 stream sometimes required the extender to drop to software decode (rather than staying in the hardware decode path) which was not supported by the playready content protection path requirements, so you got various issues of black screens, dropouts, etc. The most likely fix would probably have required an entirely new generation of extenders with a proper hardware decode capabilities, but by that time Microsoft had ended the entire WMC product, so those experiencing the issue(s) were/are basically out of luck.

(*) I think Comcast was one of the earlier examples, as they were early adopters of moving their content to H.264, but others have followed.

signcarver
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by signcarver »

What i don't like is that 6-12 months ago all the protected h.264 that cox had in Phoenix worked on both my xbox and ceton extenders as well as through the dlna (dtcp-ip) feature of my tvs. Now none of them really work and nearly everythingis h.264 and all cable channels are protected (about 7-10 locals are also protected such as comet, h&i, and even a pbs subchannel and are now h.264 though 480p). I do know that with other markets (particularly comcast but also other cox markets) that was never the case.

These days i generally watch cable live but i find myself viewing more and more off the various ota subchannels rather than cable or even the primary networks.

paulsaz
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by paulsaz »

I'm glad I have Android TV on all of my devices so at least I can watch live cable TV. Now if we would only get the DRM recording, maybe someday. I recorded a show on 102 last night and had the same problem of black screen and screen freezes while the audio keeps playing.

Watcher
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by Watcher »

signcarver wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:32 am What i don't like is that 6-12 months ago all the protected h.264 that cox had in Phoenix worked on both my xbox and ceton extenders as well as through the dlna (dtcp-ip) feature of my tvs. Now none of them really work and nearly everythingis h.264 and all cable channels are protected (about 7-10 locals are also protected such as comet, h&i, and even a pbs subchannel and are now h.264 though 480p). I do know that with other markets (particularly comcast but also other cox markets) that was never the case.
As I recall from people who actually analyzed the stream, the issue is that the encoders (or transcoders) are producing streams that are in spec, but are not being supported by some hardware decoders, and then the protected content path requirements could not be met. Early versions of the encoders/trancoders did not generate the specific things that caused the hardware to fail, but as the encoders (or their firmware) was replaced/replaced/upgraded, more and more have done so.

For Comcast, where most content was copy-freely, only the premiums (which were copy-once) had no software fallback and were called out. For other providers which choose to make more content as copy-once, it is more impactful, especially as more providers are moving to H.264 to reduce the spectrum used for TV, and, as always, those providers replace/upgrade their encoders, which mean more people are now seeing the issue for more content. There is no (known) fix other than replace the hardware, but, of course, WMC extenders will never get new hardware.

This is sort of equivalent to the hardware decoder in the nvidia shield which has a known/acknowledged hardware issue with decoding the mpeg2 stream used by some OTA broadcasters that results in "glitches" in that the stream is in spec, but the hardware does not support it. There is no fix other than replacing the hardware.

cejack
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by cejack »

OK - I have Cox and I just noticed like nothing tuning all of a sudden in the last few days. I'm in Vegas.

Anyhow, ran the firmware update and then did a whole new full channel detection again.

Everything worked after that.

Have a Prime Unit with a Cisco cable card in the unit.

Also have a Cisco STA 1520 Tuning Adapter.

- cj

mharris6829
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by mharris6829 »

"Have a Prime Unit with a Cisco cable card in the unit.

Also have a Cisco STA 1520 Tuning Adapter."

I have this same setup. Cox cable in panhandle Florida. I tried everything. I can watch a TV program on WMC on my PC. Recording is encrypted. Also, tuners do not work on the HD app on my firesticks. Cox says nothing has changed on their end.

Very confused now.

signcarver
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by signcarver »

mharris6829 wrote: Tue Aug 24, 2021 3:13 pm "Have a Prime Unit with a Cisco cable card in the unit.

Also have a Cisco STA 1520 Tuning Adapter."

I have this same setup. Cox cable in panhandle Florida. I tried everything. I can watch a TV program on WMC on my PC. Recording is encrypted. Also, tuners do not work on the HD app on my firesticks. Cox says nothing has changed on their end.

Very confused now.
Firesticks (amazon fire devices) don't support DRM, you would need iOS, win10, or "real" android, not the android port that amazon uses.

In at least 90% of cox markets on a firestick with a prime, the most you can hope to see are most of the local channels (there may be some locals that are also DRM protected) but NONE of the cable channels.

The main reason for the updated scan is for apps that use the modern method of tuning the lineup must be updated to state it is DRM protected (WMC basically detects on the fly as it uses a more legacy method of tuning rather than http streaming).

mharris6829
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by mharris6829 »

Apparently recording those DRM channels are encrypted as well. I can view via the WMC player but no other video player. Seems I am dead in the water after having 2 HDHomerun Primes for about 10 years?

Beerman
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Re: HDHomeRun Prime compatible with new Cox upgrades?

Post by Beerman »

mharris6829 wrote: Wed Aug 25, 2021 11:48 am Apparently recording those DRM channels are encrypted as well. I can view via the WMC player but no other video player. Seems I am dead in the water after having 2 HDHomerun Primes for about 10 years?
Welcome to the club! :(

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